POSTED UNDER Facelift Reviews
Don't let this happen to you! 8 ½ Wks. Mid-Face/Neck Laser Lower Eyelift - Springfield, MO
UPDATED FROM larkar
4 months post
OMG, what's happening to my face!!! 4+mos. post
larkarJune 29, 2014
I’ve tried to keep myself busy getting the house ready to put on the market and starting my business back up and trying not to deal with PS issues as I needed a break and my hair has been falling out. I don’t know if it’s because of the emotional stress or the physical stress that the PS put my body thru. Besides the receding hairline shown in the photo, I have a couple small bald spots and there’s an overall thinning going on too.
Going back to work has aggravated the neck problems. The muscle spasms have flared up again, the nerve pain in my neck and shoulder has continued, and now I have nerve issues in my lower legs and feet. I had an x-ray and I have a dislocated vertebrae in my neck. I had nerve conduction tests done and I am finally getting an MRI on Monday to access the extent of the damage.
OMG my face! It’s getting so much worse as the swelling subsides. In the photo where I’m smiling, the front part of my cheek looks like an apostrophe with a crater behind it, where did that deep angular dimple come from? Then there’s the new deep lines under my eyes that extend back to my hairline, and a new horizontal line under my nose that extends from one nasolabial fold to the other. Even my smile has been effected, that’s not how I normally smile, and there is a new horizontal ridge extending out from the corner of my mouth. If someone showed me this photo, I probably would have asked, Who is that?
In two photos, I pressed a finger to my face and you can see the indentation that shows I still have a lot for swelling at this late date. My God, if this isn’t horrendous enough, what am I going to look like when the rest of the swelling goes away??? I also included a close up to show how badly damaged my skin is, and from what I have read this will continue to worsen! I don’t understand where all those deep line under my eyes came from. And what the hell is happening with my neck! I went to take a photo of my neck with my ipad, and my allergies and asthma were acting up so I sniffed and was shocked when I saw this image of myself on the ipad. It looks like I had a tracheotomy and all the skin being pulled into it. Why on earth is that happening??? And where did all the loose skin come from??? The skin on my face seems to be stretching &/or loosening too. In the second neck photo I’m sitting back in a chair… I didn’t realize, until this photo, that it looked like I could store my lunch in the pocket in my neck! Yea, I’m having another meltdown and now the rest of my hair will probably fall out.
From the Op Report I’ve just learned that the PS used the “Smartlipo Laser”on my face. This is for use on the jawline and neck, not the face! And at a setting of 50-53 degrees Celsius which is too high according to the mfr. Was this disclosed or discussed pre-surgery? HELL NO! In consultation he talked about using a laser a little bit on my neck only, and there was NEVER any mention whatsoever of the “Smartlipo Laser” or liposuction. Interestingly, on his websites he changed the mfr’s. name of the equipment from “Smartlipo Laser” to “SmartLaser Lift”. He’s even got a second website SmartLaserLift.com with no mention of liposuction whatsoever. Every other PS’s website that I’ve seen that does laser lipo uses the mfr’s. name for the equipment which include laser and lipo in the name.
The Thermal damage to my skin is permanent and it appears other damage to my face maybe too!!! On RealSelf someone ask: BUCCCAL FAT PAD REMOVAL VS. LASER LIPOSUCTION ON YOUR FACE? Responses:
---Laser lipo of your face is downright crazy and irresponsible. It’s a set up for permanent irregularities, potential areas of fibrosis and additional things that you will not like. Charles Virden Reno Plastic Surgeon
---Liposuction is no longer done on the face. Liposuction is confined to the jawline and neck, and works best in younger patients whose skin might shrink better than older patients. When you liposuction too close to the skin, you will see grooves and ridges that are permanent and impossible to eliminate. Richard P. Rand Seattle Plastic Surgeon
---liposuction of the cheeks in not performed except in rare cases. The facial nerve is at risk. (I have a droopy lip) Scott Haupt Salt Lake City Plastic Surgeon
---keep lipo to chin and neck line - chance of disfigurement, which can be permanent. Marwan Khalifeh, Plastic Surgeon
---Except in extraordinary circumstances liposuction of the cheek is not indicated. Vincent Zubowicz, Atlanta Plastic Surgeon
Going back to work has aggravated the neck problems. The muscle spasms have flared up again, the nerve pain in my neck and shoulder has continued, and now I have nerve issues in my lower legs and feet. I had an x-ray and I have a dislocated vertebrae in my neck. I had nerve conduction tests done and I am finally getting an MRI on Monday to access the extent of the damage.
OMG my face! It’s getting so much worse as the swelling subsides. In the photo where I’m smiling, the front part of my cheek looks like an apostrophe with a crater behind it, where did that deep angular dimple come from? Then there’s the new deep lines under my eyes that extend back to my hairline, and a new horizontal line under my nose that extends from one nasolabial fold to the other. Even my smile has been effected, that’s not how I normally smile, and there is a new horizontal ridge extending out from the corner of my mouth. If someone showed me this photo, I probably would have asked, Who is that?
In two photos, I pressed a finger to my face and you can see the indentation that shows I still have a lot for swelling at this late date. My God, if this isn’t horrendous enough, what am I going to look like when the rest of the swelling goes away??? I also included a close up to show how badly damaged my skin is, and from what I have read this will continue to worsen! I don’t understand where all those deep line under my eyes came from. And what the hell is happening with my neck! I went to take a photo of my neck with my ipad, and my allergies and asthma were acting up so I sniffed and was shocked when I saw this image of myself on the ipad. It looks like I had a tracheotomy and all the skin being pulled into it. Why on earth is that happening??? And where did all the loose skin come from??? The skin on my face seems to be stretching &/or loosening too. In the second neck photo I’m sitting back in a chair… I didn’t realize, until this photo, that it looked like I could store my lunch in the pocket in my neck! Yea, I’m having another meltdown and now the rest of my hair will probably fall out.
From the Op Report I’ve just learned that the PS used the “Smartlipo Laser”on my face. This is for use on the jawline and neck, not the face! And at a setting of 50-53 degrees Celsius which is too high according to the mfr. Was this disclosed or discussed pre-surgery? HELL NO! In consultation he talked about using a laser a little bit on my neck only, and there was NEVER any mention whatsoever of the “Smartlipo Laser” or liposuction. Interestingly, on his websites he changed the mfr’s. name of the equipment from “Smartlipo Laser” to “SmartLaser Lift”. He’s even got a second website SmartLaserLift.com with no mention of liposuction whatsoever. Every other PS’s website that I’ve seen that does laser lipo uses the mfr’s. name for the equipment which include laser and lipo in the name.
The Thermal damage to my skin is permanent and it appears other damage to my face maybe too!!! On RealSelf someone ask: BUCCCAL FAT PAD REMOVAL VS. LASER LIPOSUCTION ON YOUR FACE? Responses:
---Laser lipo of your face is downright crazy and irresponsible. It’s a set up for permanent irregularities, potential areas of fibrosis and additional things that you will not like. Charles Virden Reno Plastic Surgeon
---Liposuction is no longer done on the face. Liposuction is confined to the jawline and neck, and works best in younger patients whose skin might shrink better than older patients. When you liposuction too close to the skin, you will see grooves and ridges that are permanent and impossible to eliminate. Richard P. Rand Seattle Plastic Surgeon
---liposuction of the cheeks in not performed except in rare cases. The facial nerve is at risk. (I have a droopy lip) Scott Haupt Salt Lake City Plastic Surgeon
---keep lipo to chin and neck line - chance of disfigurement, which can be permanent. Marwan Khalifeh, Plastic Surgeon
---Except in extraordinary circumstances liposuction of the cheek is not indicated. Vincent Zubowicz, Atlanta Plastic Surgeon
Replies (5)
July 1, 2014
karen i am sorry about your ordeal .I had my surgery with Dr Franco in miami and I have been very happy with the results so far. There a couple of things I would like him to do , may be fat transfer around my lips, and may lifting my eyebrows a tiny bit. He is an excellent dr, I wish you best.
July 3, 2014
Thanks! I haven't made any decisions yet on which PSs I will be visiting for consultations. I'll definitely look Dr. Franco up.
July 2, 2014
I'm so sorry things are appearing worse right now. Lipo was done on the wrong place on me, also. Bortnick lipoed my jawline (and above?), which in my case, was damaging because I didn't have enough fat there to lose! Now the area above my chin is caved in, and jaw looks too narrow.
All 3 surgeries (Bortnick & Gutek) adversely affected my smile. It's really the worst thing for me because my smile was absolutely great and was my trademark. I HAD NO IDEA THAT ANY SORT OF LIFT COULD EFFECT THE SMILE. I should have been told that, among 100s of other things. If I had known that, I would never have had any "lift" surgery ! Now I have to keep my mouth in a permanent semi-smile and the same in photos, because my smile is so weird I can't stand it. In 5 years I still haven't worked out what kind of smile could actually look good in a photo, so I keep desperately experimenting.
What my surgeons did should be so illegal that they are in prison right now where they can never hurt another person.
July 3, 2014
Without a doubt I certainly know how you feel. I too tried to keep my mouth in a permanent semi-smile at first because I hated how my mouth has been pulled down into a permanent frown. That's not easy, you have to be aware of your mouth constantly, but then my face worsen. Frown, grin or smile, now I don't know which is the lesser of the evils. I've thought too, that this should be a crime, especially since the PS knew without a doubt that he was putting me at risk by not treating the hematoma. I have him on tape making up various excuses as to why he didn't, and on his fabricated "progress notes" claiming he did.... however, not in what would normal standard of practices in treating a hematoma, I believe. So weird. In fabricating his notes for my file he made lots of errors, such as, on different dated "all sutures" were removed. In fact, I couldn't get him to remove all the sutures. I had to get my GP to remove sutures, so I have proof that the PS did not. His "Progress Notes" are certainly going to help my case. LOL, love it!
July 3, 2014
Did you find an attorney to take this on contingency? If you are planning to be sure to start now before your statute runs out. I hope he pays you millions. What a complete mess he is. Stop him before he does this again.
July 3, 2014
I now have 2 attorneys! I have a relative who is a principal at Berger Kahn a large law firm with a few locations in Calif. They do work nationally. As an established firm they get away with doing things differently. Go to an office and you'll meet Harrison Frank, a mannequin dressed in double breasted suit. He wears the suits in the office, the attorneys don't. He's named after Harris & Frank, the clothing store. He's listed along with the other attorneys and has his own webpage on their website. I have trouble asking for help on small things, I could never asked, but he stepped forward and offered to do this, he is outraged about this situation. Over the years, the bulk of his practice has been related to insurance defense. Perfect! Attorneys with a view from both sides of the table!
July 3, 2014
Glad to hear about this Karen!! Geezzz, I can't believe he never even offered you a refund. Certainly doesn't make him look good. We aren't talking about just one thing here, it's not one wonky eye or stitches that popped it's the entire thing!! I got tears in my eyes when I saw your recent update...then I got mad!! I know med mal is hard to claim because you have to prove he operated outside the standards of care (worked in law offices myself). Please let us all know if there is anything we can do for you!! XOXOX
July 4, 2014
I'm glad you're getting help with this and that things are moving forward. However, as a word of caution - if you are moving towards potential litigation, you might want to be very careful about what you post on a public forum. I want you to have support from the community here, but you may want to check with your legal team just to be safe. Remember that the internet is forever, and you certainly don't want to do anything to jeopardize your position. We're all pulling for you - just take precautions and get professional guidance so you know the parameters you're working with. Best of luck to you.
July 2, 2014
July 3, 2014
That's so sweet Drdiana, I have been watching Karens story unfold and praying she gets the helps she needs. I can't imagine how hard it's been:(
Ps: Karen I'm a stylist and just want to reassure you your hair will grow back in if the hair loss is stress related. Stress is so hard on our skin and hair. Please find ways de~stress if possible...yoga, deap breathing, acupuncture maybe? Easier said then done I know, I had skin issues and was stressed about itl for a number of years! Positive affirmations help.
July 3, 2014
Hi Drdiana, 8 months... aaaaaggghhh! This will be the longest 8 months of my life! Your willing to take this mess on? What's your name and where are you? Send me a private message, if you like, and we can chat a bit.
July 3, 2014
Larkar, with regard to the hair loss you're experiencing, if you haven't already done so, have your regular doctor run a full iron panel to see if your iron stores have been depleted. Be sure the tests include ferritin, serum iron, and % saturation - not just the hemoglobin and hematocrit. Iron deficiency can be present without anemia, and when your iron stores fall below a certain level your body can sacrifice your hair in favor of more essential organs/function. This can happen from blood loss during surgery, but also from extensive or prolonged bruising after, which can result in a more gradual, intra-vascular blood loss. You may need iron supplements, and to stop the hair loss and promote regrowth you should shoot for a ferritin level in the 70 range.
July 3, 2014
Actually, the day the Dr. told me I had a dislocated vertebrae, he said he checked my iron levels as he expected me to be low on iron. Instead he was surprised to see a significant change in my thyroid levels and I'm supposed to go back for additional tests. I'll ask, and if he hasn't done so already, I will request that he checks. Given all the damage to my neck the PS caused, I have to suspect the thyroid issues are related.
July 4, 2014
Did the dislocated vertebrae have anything to do with the ps? It's hard to understand what he could have done in a FL, neck lift that would have affected the vertebrae but, who knows, stranger things have happened I guess. At any rate I hope this horrible experience is soon behind you.
July 4, 2014
Absolutely! I had no problems whatsoever with my neck before surgery and major problems immediately after. From an PS board professional article, "During cosmetic facial surgery, the neck can be exposed to stress and strain forces acting on the cervical bony and ligamentous constructs. Under general anesthesia the surgeon may hyper-extend or hyper-rotate the neck that may risk acute injury…” How they position you and handle you during surgery is a very basic part of their education. If not you are not handled correctly you can suffer varies injuries, pressure on a nerve can cause permanent nerve damage, even death if an incorrect position blocks a vein causing a blood clot.
July 3, 2014
Oh so sorry! The hair loss needs to be addressed by a dermatologist and endocrinologist. Stress or cb thyroid problems. Is this surgeon taking any responsibility? This is what PS nightmares are made of.
July 3, 2014
I just responded to Renovation Project immediately below about a new thyroid issue before seeing your post. You are right on about the thyroid. The PS is taking no responsibility whatsoever. In fact, after all the negative responses he received with his post on here, he later made that same post on a few other websites as well. Reminds me of the definition of insanity... doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.
August 20, 2014
I am so sorry you have to go through that nightmare. I currently work for a plastic surgeon in New Haven, CT and I have never seen anything like that. I hope you can find someone that can redo the surgery and get that horrible doctor to pay for it.
August 21, 2014
Thanks for posting. I believe the doc will definitely be paying! I'm going to post later today, as time allows, on the legal situation and why I feel so confident about that.
UPDATED FROM larkar
4 months post
Thank you! I appreciate all the responses & all the support you have given me!
larkarJune 4, 2014
Your support here has been the one bright spot in all this. This has been one continuous frustration in so many ways. The latest frustration, I went back to the ophthalmologist I saw shortly before the PS. My vision has worsened, which he confirmed. However, he wouldn’t give me an RX for glasses yet as 3 ½ months post-op my eyeballs are still swollen & I cannot close either eye fully, this had led to dry eye problems. He’s talking about putting in tear duct plugs &/or surgery on my eyes! So it’s off to other specialists for additional opinions on my eyes as well as for nerve pain from the neck injury too.
Every morning when I do my makeup it’s depressing and it puts me in a pissy mood that I just can't shake. Not good when you deal with the public selling real estate, my income suffers. It's so bothersome to see people staring oddly at me or when talking to someone and their eyes veer slightly off as they look at my face. Actually, it's just as uncomfortable when they look me in the eyes.... are they looking at me or my eyes? All I can say is be very careful out there.
Thanks again! Karen
Every morning when I do my makeup it’s depressing and it puts me in a pissy mood that I just can't shake. Not good when you deal with the public selling real estate, my income suffers. It's so bothersome to see people staring oddly at me or when talking to someone and their eyes veer slightly off as they look at my face. Actually, it's just as uncomfortable when they look me in the eyes.... are they looking at me or my eyes? All I can say is be very careful out there.
Thanks again! Karen
Replies (5)
June 4, 2014
Hi Karen, sorry to hear your troubles are continuing. I have chronic dry eye (not ps related.) Ihad the tear duct plugs inserted a few years ago and it was no big deal -- took about 3 minutes in the doctor's office. You may also want to look into getting a prescription for Restasis. I find that otc lubricants like TheraTears can help alot too. Best of luck to you.
June 4, 2014
Hi Karen, ask your eye doctor if he/she could prescribe restasis. I hope everything will work out for you.
June 5, 2014
I just do not get it!!!! You did your homework & picked someone who was to be a highly regarded wonderful surgeon with rave reviews. I don't know about other ladies but this has scared the crap out of me. I am very much questioning going forward with my FL. Karen have you found another doctor who can help you with all the problems you were left with? Please say yes! If there is anything I can do, please just let me know. You are in my thoughts!! ~Hugs~
June 5, 2014
Kat, forgive me for chiming in but let me tell you, you should be scared of this surgery. I had mine 25 months ago and I'm still suffering every single day from nerve damage. (I also had a highly experienced, qualified & well regarded surgeon.) Don't let anybody tell you that surgery is anything other than a big crap shoot.
June 6, 2014
Thanks Sallie. I just got done reading a long thread on RS concerning healing taking alot longer then expected. Some women are saying three years? What? Ughhh Seriously, I don't even know what to do right now. I am thinking I might just start with baby steps. I am so sorry to hear about your nerve damage, upon review it seems many women have the same problem which is ever so lightly grazed over when you go for your consult. Who can you trust these days??
June 12, 2014
I've been ill so it's taken me a while to reply but no, I haven't found another dr. yet. I can't bring myself to even select any drs. to even consider. After what happened with the last dr. I have a lot of fears about selecting drs. How do I find a truly qualified, caring dr this time? With other types of surgeons, I've been able to find a boat load of information. Why is it that there is so little info. on cosmetic surgeons? Any suggestions for me?
June 12, 2014
Larkar, try to get some referrals from your primary care doctor or other trusted medical professional. I'm convinced that the best plastic surgeons don't need to advertise or have slick websites. When I was researching my surgery I had asked a friend of mine who is an operating room nurse to give me the name of a ps who she thought was good. She did but since I had never heard of him & he didn't have a fancy website, I didn't even go for a consultation. Instead I went with the ps who advertises in all the local glossy magazines and who had the slickest website. I wonder to this day if I would have had a better outcome with the low profile guy.
June 13, 2014
Yes, I suppose it is really hard to think about finding another plastic surgeon. Well, we know he has to have years of aesthetic plastic surgery under his belt meaning he went to school longer to specialize in PS. Some surgeons are only labeled plastic surgeons. Affiliated with a major hospital or hospitals. Overwhelming photo books and highly regarded in the plastic surgery field. I would also find a magazine with the top ten plastic surgeons in your town - that is how I found mine and then let me tell you I looked over every diploma hanging on that wall and all articles that should be written by your surgeon. I know this must be a scary thing to do --- but I will try to help you research too! Take care
June 13, 2014
I agree with a lot of what you are saying --- we want a nice website but not like a lawyer on TV begging for business. Referrals from primary -- absolutely they see patients all the time and know the physicians since they have to do the pre-op and will see all the results. OR nurses absolutely -- stop by a table when they are having lunch and just talk to them -- I did this when my son needed surgery --- right when a nurse came out the OR door I asked she could tell me her thoughts on this particular doctor/surgeon. You hit the nail right on the head with ways to find a surgeon.
June 15, 2014
You might try Dr. Andrews at KU Medical Center.
I found him to be kind and honest.
Brian Andrews, M.D.
Director, Cleft and Craniofacial Surgery
Assistant Professor
As Director of Cleft and Craniofacial Surgery, Dr. Andrews coordinates a team of expert physicians and healthcare providers who specialize in complex craniomaxillofacial anomalies in both pediatric and adult patients. Dr. Andrews' practice includes children with congenital problems such as cleft lip and palate, craniosynostosis, ear anomalies, and jaw abnormalities. He also treats adults with traumatic facial injuries, facial paralysis, and problems related to head and neck cancer including melanoma.
Dr. Andrews also specializes in facial cosmetic surgery. He commonly performs operations such as rhinoplasty (nose surgery), face and browlift, blepharoplasty (eyelid surgery), otoplasty (ear pinning), chin augmentation, facial implants, and facial fat grafting. He also commonly performs revision or secondary cosmetic surgery for patients who are unhappy with prior aesthetic procedures.
Dr. Andrews is board certified by both the American Board of Plastic Surgery and the American Board of Otolaryngology-Head & Neck Surgery. Before joining the University of Kansas faculty, he completed a plastic surgery residency at Harvard University in Boston, Massachusetts; and an otolaryngology (ENT) residency at the University of Iowa in Iowa City, Iowa. Dr. Andrews has also completed a craniofacial fellowship at UCLA in Los Angeles.
In addition to his clinical practice, Dr. Andrews conducts both basic science and clinical research. His basic science laboratory focuses on neurocognitive deficits associated with skull and head injury as well as the discovery of genetic mutations that cause cleft and craniofacial anomalies. His clinical research focuses on identifying and treating developmental delays associated with pediatric head shape anomalies, outcomes of speech and hearing deficits in children with cleft and craniofacial anomalies, and treatment outcomes in patients with maxillofacial trauma and malignancy.
June 16, 2014
I'm so sorry to hear you've had so many problems too. I greatly appreciate the info. and will be checking into Dr. Andrews. What type of procedures did he do for you?
June 16, 2014
I just checked Dr. Andrews board certification with the American Board of Plastic Surgery. He's only been board certified for 1 1/2 years. I think I would want someone with a little more experience than that. The first attorney that I talked to (a top attorney that only does medical malpractice) suggested it would be better if I use a PS from a University Medical Center. I don't know his thinking on that but it seems they just don't have the level of experience that I would be comfortable with.
June 16, 2014
There is a magazine is Springfield that has my PS as one of the top surgeons in that area!There are only 4 board certified PSs in the area that I live in and none are facial specialist.
June 16, 2014
I didn't have any procedure from Dr. Andrews. He knows I need a FL revisions, but, unfortunately, I have too much scar tissue on the sides, and not enough skin left to close. But for someone else, the answer may be different. I just mention him because he seems kind, honest, and competent, and those qualities are not as common in this field as many assume. (I personally think that those 3 qualities in this field are rather rare.)
June 20, 2014
Larkar, Just something to consider regarding Dr Andrews recent Amer Board of Plastic surgery certification. Most PS are NOT certified by that particular board. The fact that he IS is pretty unusual and the fact that he only recently sought this certification does NOT mean that he lacks experience. As I said most do not have this certification and so it is not a requirement at all. Dr Andrews ( for all I know he may have started in private practice last yr) or any other doctor may have been practicing facial plastic surgery for decades and then, at a certain point, decide that this is a credential they wish to get. Btw some so-called board that these guys are affiliated with (such as the Board of Facial and Resconstructive Plastic surgeons) do not function with the same requirements such as periodic re-examination as the boards that fall under the auspices of the American Board of Medical Specialties. THat oversight board and its affiliate boards are the creme de la creme. Just sayin.... :) grace
June 23, 2014
I copied this off vitals: Dr. Brian Thomas Andrews MD is a male Otolaryngologist, has 8 years of experience and practices in Otolaryngology, Plastic Surgery, and Surgery at KUMC. I couldn't find how long he's been with KU.
I don't think he's a "facelift specialist," which are rare in this area. And he is cautious about facelifts and he said he advises most patients to NOT get one. (I'd give anything if I'd met him before my disasters. I think just a nudge would have stopped me and saved my face.)
That's not to say he might not consider a revisions. So, if you're looking for a very kind, careful, and cautious viewpoint, I think he'd fit that bill. That is how I perceived him in my consultation.
June 24, 2014
Being as you are so enthusiastic about this Dr. I will be definitely checking into him further. I so appreciate that you've taken the time to let me know about him. Thank you!
June 6, 2014
This is tragic ...to gouge this woman for so much money and leave her looking much worse than when she came to you to make her look and feel prettier and more youthful. I hope she sues you...she shouldn't just get a refund..what about time off work..damages for malpractice on her face. She needs to abe awarded $200.000 just for damages and recuperation time.. What a horrible thing to do to someone....and then act so blase and trite about it!! Ugh this is unbelievable..
June 6, 2014
I also find it funny that the last review before this one was 3 years ago. Now suddenly there are 3 with NO pictures in the last 22 days...damage control much?
Replies (5)
.Is unfathomable. Godspeed and bless you. Stay strong sister. Xx