POSTED UNDER Botox REVIEWS
don't do it!!!! - Edmonds, WA
ORIGINAL POST
I'm 63 but blessed with great genes, so look...
foreveryounglibraApril 7, 2012
$350
I'm 63 but blessed with great genes, so look 50. I do have frown lines between my eyes. Went to a female MD who specializes in laser therapies, botox, fillers, etc. She injected what she said was a "very conservative" amount just into the two frown wrinkles and another injection slightly above and between them. I was given the impression that it would just keep me from frowning, and no more. OMG. Two weeks later and my entire forehead is frozen and unmovable except for the outer sides, which pull up on the ends of my eyebrows making me look like Spock. Both eyelids droop, my previously nice brows dive toward my nose, and I look perpetually angry.
I went back and she injected a TINY amount in the muscles on the outer sides of my forehead so that it will relax and my eyebrows will not look so freakish....but they still look bizarre. I'm AFRAID to get any more because my eyelids might droop even worse (now they just droop on the inside half). I cannot believe that I paid money to look worse than I ever have in my life. I am afraid to have any friends or family see me because they will ask what happened. I am depressed, my forehead feels numb, and I pray daily that this will wear off sooner than later. I am now wearing sunglasses everywhere, and am going to look freakish for months. I've read a lot of blogs but have any of you been successful in finding anything that actually worked to make this stuff go away faster? I really want to warn everyone not to do this, and if you must, ask for a tiniest amount possible, then wait two-three weeks to see what it looks like. According to my doctor, *some* people react like I did, but I wasn't told that could happen beforehand. I trusted her expertise. She is very sweet and feels terrible, so I won't share her name.
Replies (5)
April 11, 2012
Hi - the same thing happened to me. I have had botox before with great results. This time however, my forehead is completely frozen, I have the spock eyebrows (but only on one side, the other eyebrow lost its arch and is flat). My eyes look small and beady, and I have bags and wrinkles under my eyes when I smile. I am 4 weeks out and no improvement yet. Its been a long 4 weeks and I know I have a long way to go before I look normal again, if I ever do. I have been hiding behind dark rimmed glasses and I look expressionless.
UPDATED FROM foreveryounglibra
2 Months Post Injections Update Botox still...
foreveryounglibraMay 17, 2012
2 Months Post Injections Update
Botox still very obvious in my forehead, which feels like it has permanent Novocaine. It makes me nauseous to focus on it, so I try very hard not to think about it. The tiny amount she injected higher on my forehead over the outer ends of my eyebrows to correct the "Spock" effect created by the original injections over my nose in the frown lines, is wearing off faster than the original injections between my eyes, so when I raise my eyebrows (which I can do a tiny bit now), there are deep wrinkles and puckering over my outer eyebrows that weren't there before. My eyelids are still hooded and droopy and have an extra fold now that I didn't have before.
At my age (63, though I used to look 50), I don't know if the skin will recover. Because my eyebrows have now "fallen," I also have extra new crows' feet type wrinkles on the insides of my upper eyelids (next to my nose) which I did not have before. Don't know if they will go away after this or not, either. As the middle third of my forehead is frozen, and the outside two thirds not, when I wake up every morning I now have deep prominent vertical lines that extend from the middle of my forehead, down through my eyebrows and onto the tops of the eyelids on both sides. Obviously, that happens because I'm a side-sleeper. Never had even a hint of these lines before. VERY aging.
I continue to use my Galvanic Spa (a home-version from NuSkin) almost daily, and it makes a huge difference. My eyelids are completely droopy before a treatment and are significantly lifted afterward. Still nothing close to my normal appearance. I used to love making up my eyes with shadows, liner, etc..for the big, smoky effect. All I can do now is put on dark liner and mascara in hopes of looking less old and tired. I can hardly wait for this poison to completely go away, and pray that I will again have full function of my forehead muscles, which I read on a doctor's blog that an older person NEEDS to keep their eyes more open.
If you're 50 or older, you should know that Botox will disable those muscles and your eyebrows will drop as a result...which definitely does not make you look younger! I would NEVER, had I been informed, have opted for fallen eyebrows and droopy eyelids in trade for fewer wrinkles in my forehead. I didn't have that many, and was told that the Botox would just "soften" the frown lines. The irony is that the frown lines are still very prominent, but frozen.
Still hating it, but getting through it. Scared I won't completely recover. Looking into Ultherapy now.
Botox still very obvious in my forehead, which feels like it has permanent Novocaine. It makes me nauseous to focus on it, so I try very hard not to think about it. The tiny amount she injected higher on my forehead over the outer ends of my eyebrows to correct the "Spock" effect created by the original injections over my nose in the frown lines, is wearing off faster than the original injections between my eyes, so when I raise my eyebrows (which I can do a tiny bit now), there are deep wrinkles and puckering over my outer eyebrows that weren't there before. My eyelids are still hooded and droopy and have an extra fold now that I didn't have before.
At my age (63, though I used to look 50), I don't know if the skin will recover. Because my eyebrows have now "fallen," I also have extra new crows' feet type wrinkles on the insides of my upper eyelids (next to my nose) which I did not have before. Don't know if they will go away after this or not, either. As the middle third of my forehead is frozen, and the outside two thirds not, when I wake up every morning I now have deep prominent vertical lines that extend from the middle of my forehead, down through my eyebrows and onto the tops of the eyelids on both sides. Obviously, that happens because I'm a side-sleeper. Never had even a hint of these lines before. VERY aging.
I continue to use my Galvanic Spa (a home-version from NuSkin) almost daily, and it makes a huge difference. My eyelids are completely droopy before a treatment and are significantly lifted afterward. Still nothing close to my normal appearance. I used to love making up my eyes with shadows, liner, etc..for the big, smoky effect. All I can do now is put on dark liner and mascara in hopes of looking less old and tired. I can hardly wait for this poison to completely go away, and pray that I will again have full function of my forehead muscles, which I read on a doctor's blog that an older person NEEDS to keep their eyes more open.
If you're 50 or older, you should know that Botox will disable those muscles and your eyebrows will drop as a result...which definitely does not make you look younger! I would NEVER, had I been informed, have opted for fallen eyebrows and droopy eyelids in trade for fewer wrinkles in my forehead. I didn't have that many, and was told that the Botox would just "soften" the frown lines. The irony is that the frown lines are still very prominent, but frozen.
Still hating it, but getting through it. Scared I won't completely recover. Looking into Ultherapy now.
Replies (3)
May 18, 2012
I can completely understand why you would feel afraid you might not fully recover, but my guess is in another couple of months it will have worn off & you will be back to normal. I know this kind of stuff can be so frustrating, and even depressing at times, but do your best to keep a positive attitude and know that each day is one day closer to the Botox being out of your system. Hoping that goes as quick as possible for you!!
June 17, 2012
well its been ten months for me megan and im still not back to 'normal'. ten months. ten months of looking like hell and 20 years older. that is a lot of big fat B.S.
frustrating and depresing, yeah that might cover it, if it really were just a 'couple months' of slight inconveneince.... after ten months, of wearing hats everywhere, avoiding normal social situations, and people asking what the hell i did to my previously normal, healthy face, no this is no longer depressing and frustrating..... this has gone way, way, way way way beyond that. i genuinely appreciate your endless attempts to be positive in the face of the overwhelming human destruction described on this site, it cant be easy, however the truth is that this stuff is a big lot of BS and you know what, basically the people who sell and administer this stuff should (and i certainly hope, someday will) be brought up on criminal charges. that is certainly what they all deserve. not just for routinely completely ruining lives and huge chunks of people's lives, but straight up LYING about it.
like foreveryounglibra said: we were not ever informed that this stuff would make us -worse-. we were told this would 'soften' a few lines.... you know it doesn't 'soften' anything.... it turns your face into an immoblized rock. thats not softer, thats harder. the correct term should be 'paralyzes'. it gives you wrinkles and makes your existing wrinkles worse.... thats not younger, thats older. the correct term should be 'ruins' your face. quit using the double speak and wake up and smell the coffee people.
frustrating and depresing, yeah that might cover it, if it really were just a 'couple months' of slight inconveneince.... after ten months, of wearing hats everywhere, avoiding normal social situations, and people asking what the hell i did to my previously normal, healthy face, no this is no longer depressing and frustrating..... this has gone way, way, way way way beyond that. i genuinely appreciate your endless attempts to be positive in the face of the overwhelming human destruction described on this site, it cant be easy, however the truth is that this stuff is a big lot of BS and you know what, basically the people who sell and administer this stuff should (and i certainly hope, someday will) be brought up on criminal charges. that is certainly what they all deserve. not just for routinely completely ruining lives and huge chunks of people's lives, but straight up LYING about it.
like foreveryounglibra said: we were not ever informed that this stuff would make us -worse-. we were told this would 'soften' a few lines.... you know it doesn't 'soften' anything.... it turns your face into an immoblized rock. thats not softer, thats harder. the correct term should be 'paralyzes'. it gives you wrinkles and makes your existing wrinkles worse.... thats not younger, thats older. the correct term should be 'ruins' your face. quit using the double speak and wake up and smell the coffee people.
March 19, 2018
Botox is terrible. I had it at 28 for my 11s. My left eyelid drooped and still hasn’t fully recovered two years on plus sometimes it still pains. I feel like disabling your muscles in your fAce is actually ageing because those muscles also keep your face “lifted.” I should have figured this when I saw how terrible the receptionist looked. These injectors are full of it and liars to say there are no permanent effects and that this is a “rare occurrence”. It’s awful how Botox is advertised as risk free. It’s not and this drooping thing is more common than they make it out to be
UPDATED FROM foreveryounglibra
Update: 13 Weeks (about 3 months) post bad botox...
foreveryounglibraJune 16, 2012
Update: 13 Weeks (about 3 months) post bad botox injections in forehead. It supposedly lasts 3-9 months.
I continue using my home version Galvanic Spa (by Nuskin) three times a week. It helps lift my eyelids on the days that I use it.
Some of the botox is starting to wear off...in particular, the tiny injections that she put over the outsides of my eyebrows after she over-injected the middle of my forehead and "Spocked me" (her words).
The supposedly "conservative amount" that she put between my eyebrows in the frown lines (which turned out to be waaaaay too much) is very slowly lessening, and I have a tiny bit more movement in my forehead now, and my eyelids aren't quite as droopy. BUT, because the middle part of my forehead still doesn't move, while the outsides do, and because I'm a side sleeper, I have very deep vertical creases that run down through the middle of my eyebrows every morning. Because this has been happening for three months now, the creases are becoming permanent and don't relax or go completely away during the day. I've tried taping these areas before bed, but my forehead just wrinkles up elsewhere and looks bizarre.
I also still have the other eyelid wrinkles that I did NOT have before which start at the inner eye and "splay" across the eyelids. These are because there is still a lot of botox in the lower middle of my forehead and between my eyes and those areas now sag, which means I can't hold my eyes open, so the extra folds of skin bunch up.
My forehead is STILL "numb" and leaden (feels heavy, like it's hanging down, which it IS). I've forgotten what my "old" eyes used to look like (bright and open). They were a great canvas for dramatic eye makeup. I haven't been able to wear hardly any since this nightmare began. All I can do is some liner at the base of the lashes and mascara. My droopy eyes have also been more susceptible to allergy irritation.
My class reunion is coming up, and the prom queen won't be going. I look at least ten years older than I did last year because of what this doctor did to me. HATE IT HATE IT HATE IT HATE IT, AND STILL WANT TO WARN EVERYONE ABOUT IT. THERE'S NO WAY RISKING THIS DISFIGUREMENT AND PRE-MATURE AGING OF YOUR EYES IS WORTH 'SOFTENING' A FEW WRINKLES.
I continue using my home version Galvanic Spa (by Nuskin) three times a week. It helps lift my eyelids on the days that I use it.
Some of the botox is starting to wear off...in particular, the tiny injections that she put over the outsides of my eyebrows after she over-injected the middle of my forehead and "Spocked me" (her words).
The supposedly "conservative amount" that she put between my eyebrows in the frown lines (which turned out to be waaaaay too much) is very slowly lessening, and I have a tiny bit more movement in my forehead now, and my eyelids aren't quite as droopy. BUT, because the middle part of my forehead still doesn't move, while the outsides do, and because I'm a side sleeper, I have very deep vertical creases that run down through the middle of my eyebrows every morning. Because this has been happening for three months now, the creases are becoming permanent and don't relax or go completely away during the day. I've tried taping these areas before bed, but my forehead just wrinkles up elsewhere and looks bizarre.
I also still have the other eyelid wrinkles that I did NOT have before which start at the inner eye and "splay" across the eyelids. These are because there is still a lot of botox in the lower middle of my forehead and between my eyes and those areas now sag, which means I can't hold my eyes open, so the extra folds of skin bunch up.
My forehead is STILL "numb" and leaden (feels heavy, like it's hanging down, which it IS). I've forgotten what my "old" eyes used to look like (bright and open). They were a great canvas for dramatic eye makeup. I haven't been able to wear hardly any since this nightmare began. All I can do is some liner at the base of the lashes and mascara. My droopy eyes have also been more susceptible to allergy irritation.
My class reunion is coming up, and the prom queen won't be going. I look at least ten years older than I did last year because of what this doctor did to me. HATE IT HATE IT HATE IT HATE IT, AND STILL WANT TO WARN EVERYONE ABOUT IT. THERE'S NO WAY RISKING THIS DISFIGUREMENT AND PRE-MATURE AGING OF YOUR EYES IS WORTH 'SOFTENING' A FEW WRINKLES.
Replies (10)
June 16, 2012
It makes me so sad to hear you aren't going to go to your reunion because of this. :( I understand though. I'm glad to hear it is wearing off. My guess is the lines you are seeing form will disappear once you have full movement back, but I'll be really interested to hear what actually happens with that.
Sending you a hug!
June 17, 2012
Thanks so much, as always, for the compassion, comfort and encouragement, Megan, while we rant on and on! :D You are certainly the person for this job!
Anne88's report is painful to read, but the truth often is, and I am thankful, again for this forum in the hopes that many, many women will read our "real life stories" and be spared the same misery.
I take full responsibility for not informing myself of the possible repercussions before I impulsively agreed to the injections. We cannot expect practitioners to warn us (though they SHOULD). She didn't inject me against my will, and I'm fairly certain that I waived all rights when I signed all of those pages of paperwork. However, I DO think the stuff should be banned for "casual" cosmetic use, and it should be against the law for practitioners NOT to warn patients of every possible side-effect. Mine are cosmetic, but it's awful to read where people experienced panic attacks and other negative psychological effects also !
I know it sounds shallow that I would skip my reunion over this, but I just don't want people looking at me and it being obvious that I've "had something done." I've always looked great "for my age," and never wanted, nor ever will want anything that changes my appearance the way this has...for the WORSE. My eyelids have lost all elasticity now, and have double folds, and my eyes remain much smaller (squinty and often bloodshot) than they were before.
The only reason I look in the mirror is to gauge if there is any improvement, but "recovery" is so slow that it's almost imperceptible, and if it's an allergy-kind-of-a-day, then my eyes are still fully hooded. I hope and pray that it wears off sooner than later (ten months? OMG).
I would love to believe that my 63-year-old skin will revive and the deep new wrinkles will disappear, but I don't think so (maybe the Galvanic Spa will save me?). My reasoning is that when they first showed up (I'm talking mainly about the long deep, vertical wrinkles that run through my eyebrows), it was in the mornings (because of sleeping on my side and my forehead not moving in the middle), and by afternoon they would relax and be gone. Now, after three months of creasing, they are still there by nighttime. Maybe you're right. Maybe when the Botox completely wears off, and (if) the creasing stops during the night, they'll go away.
I do want to mention that you can use micro pore tape (and anne recommended "Frownies") in little strips on places to help keep wrinkles from deepening at night. But the problem is that when I've tried it, my forehead just puffed up scrunched in other places which looks really weird, too. Sigh.
I honestly think that I'm going to need an eye lift after this. Certainly nothing I'd ever planned on, and knowing, now, how much can go wrong, it terrifies me.
Still loving life...I'm not completely consumed by vanity! :D
Anne88's report is painful to read, but the truth often is, and I am thankful, again for this forum in the hopes that many, many women will read our "real life stories" and be spared the same misery.
I take full responsibility for not informing myself of the possible repercussions before I impulsively agreed to the injections. We cannot expect practitioners to warn us (though they SHOULD). She didn't inject me against my will, and I'm fairly certain that I waived all rights when I signed all of those pages of paperwork. However, I DO think the stuff should be banned for "casual" cosmetic use, and it should be against the law for practitioners NOT to warn patients of every possible side-effect. Mine are cosmetic, but it's awful to read where people experienced panic attacks and other negative psychological effects also !
I know it sounds shallow that I would skip my reunion over this, but I just don't want people looking at me and it being obvious that I've "had something done." I've always looked great "for my age," and never wanted, nor ever will want anything that changes my appearance the way this has...for the WORSE. My eyelids have lost all elasticity now, and have double folds, and my eyes remain much smaller (squinty and often bloodshot) than they were before.
The only reason I look in the mirror is to gauge if there is any improvement, but "recovery" is so slow that it's almost imperceptible, and if it's an allergy-kind-of-a-day, then my eyes are still fully hooded. I hope and pray that it wears off sooner than later (ten months? OMG).
I would love to believe that my 63-year-old skin will revive and the deep new wrinkles will disappear, but I don't think so (maybe the Galvanic Spa will save me?). My reasoning is that when they first showed up (I'm talking mainly about the long deep, vertical wrinkles that run through my eyebrows), it was in the mornings (because of sleeping on my side and my forehead not moving in the middle), and by afternoon they would relax and be gone. Now, after three months of creasing, they are still there by nighttime. Maybe you're right. Maybe when the Botox completely wears off, and (if) the creasing stops during the night, they'll go away.
I do want to mention that you can use micro pore tape (and anne recommended "Frownies") in little strips on places to help keep wrinkles from deepening at night. But the problem is that when I've tried it, my forehead just puffed up scrunched in other places which looks really weird, too. Sigh.
I honestly think that I'm going to need an eye lift after this. Certainly nothing I'd ever planned on, and knowing, now, how much can go wrong, it terrifies me.
Still loving life...I'm not completely consumed by vanity! :D
June 18, 2012
I'm so glad to hear you are still loving life!! :)
Anne88 certainly has a valid point that it seems people don't fully understand the potential risks when they decide to try something like Botox, and you certainly are not alone in rushing through the papers and not fully reading it all.
As you both probably know that is one of the main reason RealSelf exists, to try to help people approach medi-beauty decisions as safe as possible, though of course they will never be without risk. Anyways, we pulled some data recently to see if going to a board certified doctor increased satisfaction, compared with the overall satisfaction rate of community members who had the procedure done. Here is a blog post about it. The differences seen in the injectables is pretty interesting, I thought.
June 19, 2012
well the thing is that even doctors dont really seem to understand the risks to be able to communicate them.... and they seem to have pretty much no knowlege whatsoever of what to do when something goes wrong. this is my main complaint. if the doctors were up front about the real risks and people were given true opportunity for really informed consent, and if people were not treated so terribly when something goes wrong, i think there would be a much higher satisfaction rating for injectables. i honestly dont believe my doctor provided me with the opportunity for adequate informed consent. for instance, i went to a very qualified dr. his name is Mark Jewell, he used to be president of the ASAPS. i bought the myth that i would be safe, if i went to a good doctor. this really doesnt offer all that much protection and actually gives a false sense of security. he had done another much more difficult surgery for me last year in which he was extremely diligent informing me of all risks, all downsides, all med interactions, he was extremely careful about this for that procedure.... and his attitude of carefulness at that time and the really great job he did led me to believe he was appropriately cautions with all the procedures he performed. this is in total contrast to his attitude of 'this is nothing' when i asked him about injectables. he led me to believe with his attitude toward them, that it was pretty much without any risk. he told me even in the worst case scenario it always goes away in a few months, he told me all side effects were always mild and transitory. the consent form i signed was only half a page long, and it glossed over everything saying it was all 'mild and transitory' and there was basically no risk. my doctor treated it like a total formality and didn't ask about my medical history, other meds i was taking, nothing. in the official medication guide from allergan it says that doctors should always take a medical history and should always pay attention to concurrent medications..... i can see by reading the stories here how few doctors actually do that.
i read that paper and it said nothing about permanent damage to the face or severe health problems lasting years. if it had, i would not have done the procedure. i did it because i trusted my doctor to use adequate caution when administering dangerous substances and because i was assured by my doctor directly, and also by his extremely casual attitude, an attitude that many many doctors seem to blindly adhere to, that this procedure was basically a littlie simple nothing thing, without risk. thats the way its marketed, and this is deceptive advertising.
this is my complaint. this stuff should not be treated anywhere near as casually as it is treated, by everyone. and i believe the reason that it is treated so casually, is because the manufacturers and doctors deliberately falsely market it that way. if you inform people there are risks to a procedure, they may not spend $400 for that ten minute procedure. and noone likes that, right?
if you aggressively promote the myth that there are no risks, even when you know that there are, and then just deny it when negative things happen, and blame it on some ridiculous virus or something so the patient never reports it to the fda, skewing the data, then again, who does that benefit. those making money. of course they want as many people as possible getting tricked into doing this on a whim or doing it without as much research as they might use, for a procedure that is known to carry risk. if this were correctly marketed as something that can be actually extremely risky, people would be aware that they need to research it just as carefully as any more complicated procedure.
or course they want people to feel there is no risk. then they dont have to provide adequate informed consent, they dont have to take responsibility for the damage they do. they can just keep raking in the cash. doctors who should know better fully buy into this, out of convenience, stupidity, laziness, or just greed, or because the company gives them kickbacks (yes we know about that) and as such they are totally responsible in my view. its very sad because doctors themselves are causing the public to lose faith in their expertise because its just so obvious they know absolutely nothing about this product, how it works, what it does, or how to correctly or safely use it.
i read the papers i was given to sign and they did not mention any of the things that i and others have experienced. this is lack of appropriate informed consent and this is directly the manufacturers, the FDA's, and the administering injectors fault. we go to them for their expertise and when they use deceptive marketing, this is their fault. even if the advertisements it still states there has been 'no significant recorded case' of toxin spreading and causing serious illness. how can they honestly say that? what planet are they on?
in my view every time this stuff is administered there should be a full medical history taken. before and after pictures should be taken. patients should be given a checklist, they must put check marks beside the medicines they take, the health conditions they have, if they had prior surgery or injury to their face. they should be fully informed that people often become very sick, sometimes for years, and that permanent damage can be done. patients should be provided with a chart showing where they were injected, and with what dose and dilution.
patients should -never- be told the marketing lie that they will be 'completely back to normal in a few months'. it takes some people years to return to normal, if ever. this is a huge and damaging lie. if i had been informed of this honestly, i would -never- ever have chosen to take this risk. i must repeat this was presented to me as a procedure with no risk, i never saw in any papers mention of permanent damage. this is seriously minimizing the true risks and is -not- informed consent. patients should be informed this is not something to do casually but something potentially life changing and life altering and that if something goes wrong, there is currently -no- treatment or cure. none. you can try to go to your doctor with your symptoms, and they will tell you you have a virus and not to call them again. patients should definitely be informed of this.
now that would be adequate informed consent and i think a lot of these horror stories would stop happening if more appropriate care was taken ever single time, -before- getting that easy $400 for a ten minute job, administering this extremely dangerous and obviously very poorly understood product.
and megan i do think this is a very useful site and its good that people can give their honest feedback. i think where this site falls down, is that still even here, doctors are not being honest, they say one thing and then another, they contradict each other and themselves, they pretty much just parrot what they were taught to say by allergan and medicis. and they really just hem and haw around the fact that as i said, they obvously have absolutely no real idea how this stuff actually works or what it does. becuase of that really they are just continuing to promote all the dangerous myths and misleading people. so on that side, this site is pretty inadequate. in terms of letting people give the real truth in their own stories, yes this is always good thing.
i read that paper and it said nothing about permanent damage to the face or severe health problems lasting years. if it had, i would not have done the procedure. i did it because i trusted my doctor to use adequate caution when administering dangerous substances and because i was assured by my doctor directly, and also by his extremely casual attitude, an attitude that many many doctors seem to blindly adhere to, that this procedure was basically a littlie simple nothing thing, without risk. thats the way its marketed, and this is deceptive advertising.
this is my complaint. this stuff should not be treated anywhere near as casually as it is treated, by everyone. and i believe the reason that it is treated so casually, is because the manufacturers and doctors deliberately falsely market it that way. if you inform people there are risks to a procedure, they may not spend $400 for that ten minute procedure. and noone likes that, right?
if you aggressively promote the myth that there are no risks, even when you know that there are, and then just deny it when negative things happen, and blame it on some ridiculous virus or something so the patient never reports it to the fda, skewing the data, then again, who does that benefit. those making money. of course they want as many people as possible getting tricked into doing this on a whim or doing it without as much research as they might use, for a procedure that is known to carry risk. if this were correctly marketed as something that can be actually extremely risky, people would be aware that they need to research it just as carefully as any more complicated procedure.
or course they want people to feel there is no risk. then they dont have to provide adequate informed consent, they dont have to take responsibility for the damage they do. they can just keep raking in the cash. doctors who should know better fully buy into this, out of convenience, stupidity, laziness, or just greed, or because the company gives them kickbacks (yes we know about that) and as such they are totally responsible in my view. its very sad because doctors themselves are causing the public to lose faith in their expertise because its just so obvious they know absolutely nothing about this product, how it works, what it does, or how to correctly or safely use it.
i read the papers i was given to sign and they did not mention any of the things that i and others have experienced. this is lack of appropriate informed consent and this is directly the manufacturers, the FDA's, and the administering injectors fault. we go to them for their expertise and when they use deceptive marketing, this is their fault. even if the advertisements it still states there has been 'no significant recorded case' of toxin spreading and causing serious illness. how can they honestly say that? what planet are they on?
in my view every time this stuff is administered there should be a full medical history taken. before and after pictures should be taken. patients should be given a checklist, they must put check marks beside the medicines they take, the health conditions they have, if they had prior surgery or injury to their face. they should be fully informed that people often become very sick, sometimes for years, and that permanent damage can be done. patients should be provided with a chart showing where they were injected, and with what dose and dilution.
patients should -never- be told the marketing lie that they will be 'completely back to normal in a few months'. it takes some people years to return to normal, if ever. this is a huge and damaging lie. if i had been informed of this honestly, i would -never- ever have chosen to take this risk. i must repeat this was presented to me as a procedure with no risk, i never saw in any papers mention of permanent damage. this is seriously minimizing the true risks and is -not- informed consent. patients should be informed this is not something to do casually but something potentially life changing and life altering and that if something goes wrong, there is currently -no- treatment or cure. none. you can try to go to your doctor with your symptoms, and they will tell you you have a virus and not to call them again. patients should definitely be informed of this.
now that would be adequate informed consent and i think a lot of these horror stories would stop happening if more appropriate care was taken ever single time, -before- getting that easy $400 for a ten minute job, administering this extremely dangerous and obviously very poorly understood product.
and megan i do think this is a very useful site and its good that people can give their honest feedback. i think where this site falls down, is that still even here, doctors are not being honest, they say one thing and then another, they contradict each other and themselves, they pretty much just parrot what they were taught to say by allergan and medicis. and they really just hem and haw around the fact that as i said, they obvously have absolutely no real idea how this stuff actually works or what it does. becuase of that really they are just continuing to promote all the dangerous myths and misleading people. so on that side, this site is pretty inadequate. in terms of letting people give the real truth in their own stories, yes this is always good thing.
June 19, 2012
hey foreveryounglibra, i do want to say the frownies have really made a big, big difference in the severity of those horrifying vertical wrinkles.... the reason they work better than just tape or bandaids is they are a little stiff, they are like light cardboard.... so they dont crinkle up. they hold the skin flat. honestly they have been the only thing that has helped, i really do recommend them, i think id be much much worse by now if i hadn't found them, and if i do get better i will credit the frownies, (certainly not any doctors thats for sure!) becasue they dont allow that deep creasing at night that caused so much damage. now in the morning i wake up looking almost normal from wearing the frownies, rather than waking up with horrifying creases that take hours to go away (if at all). i feel like if i had started using them earlier i might have even prevented this from ever getting this bad and probably would have recovered much much sooner. its such a relief to have something that prevents me from distorting intio all those unnatural positions. god that was so uncomfortable. // i dont know about you but it doesnt just look weird it also feels very very uncomfortable to me. // and-- please know im not just 'better' cause all this time has passed, i only showed any improvement at all after using a physical device to physically hold my muscles in the proper shape, especially at night, like a splint. that was the only thing that caused improvement. i dont think i would have improved at all by now without that.
so i really recommend them, since the skin is damaged from the constant creasing and uncreasing, once the wrinkles are there they dont go away..... so preventing the creasing really really seems to help. they also cut down the puffiness too. seriously you can get 144 of them for like $15 on amazon, best deal ever.
im sorry too about your reunion.. but boy do i know where you are coming from. thats what i mean about the human cost. multiply that by so many people. missing good experiences, weddings, reunions, parties, dates, on and on. for months and months out of their lives.. having problems with their families and in their social relationships... some people trying to find a job! can you imagine.//
its very ironic that people often do such stuff for a little 'lift' or to feel more confident, and it seems so ironic and cruel that it does the opposite and lasts soooooo long. it really can definitely ruin someones life, and very certainly change the course of it, without trying too hard. i just had to meet my boyfriends parents and whole family for the first time..... // we spent a week together. that was so mortifying. i had to wear hats all the time, and i felt so self conscious. we were together late at night and early in the morning, times when i usually look my worst. you know, people form first impressions about you, they look at your face. without saying anyting your face talks about who you are and what your character is like. ive never felt ashamed of my face before but now i do.
i dont want people to think that 'this' is the real me. i earned my wrinkles and i love every one. thats my character. i didn't want my 'wrinkles' to go anywhere. i just wanted my expression softened a bit, and i was very clear thats what i wanted.. instead i got paralyzed and disfigured. thats significant human cost. we are real people with lives. its just not ok. hope you feel better soon really i do.
so i really recommend them, since the skin is damaged from the constant creasing and uncreasing, once the wrinkles are there they dont go away..... so preventing the creasing really really seems to help. they also cut down the puffiness too. seriously you can get 144 of them for like $15 on amazon, best deal ever.
im sorry too about your reunion.. but boy do i know where you are coming from. thats what i mean about the human cost. multiply that by so many people. missing good experiences, weddings, reunions, parties, dates, on and on. for months and months out of their lives.. having problems with their families and in their social relationships... some people trying to find a job! can you imagine.//
its very ironic that people often do such stuff for a little 'lift' or to feel more confident, and it seems so ironic and cruel that it does the opposite and lasts soooooo long. it really can definitely ruin someones life, and very certainly change the course of it, without trying too hard. i just had to meet my boyfriends parents and whole family for the first time..... // we spent a week together. that was so mortifying. i had to wear hats all the time, and i felt so self conscious. we were together late at night and early in the morning, times when i usually look my worst. you know, people form first impressions about you, they look at your face. without saying anyting your face talks about who you are and what your character is like. ive never felt ashamed of my face before but now i do.
i dont want people to think that 'this' is the real me. i earned my wrinkles and i love every one. thats my character. i didn't want my 'wrinkles' to go anywhere. i just wanted my expression softened a bit, and i was very clear thats what i wanted.. instead i got paralyzed and disfigured. thats significant human cost. we are real people with lives. its just not ok. hope you feel better soon really i do.
June 19, 2012
I definitely hear what you are saying about people needing to know about the risks. When I had my injections done (in 2 different offices) I did have to give a medical history report, and I did have to sign off on a paper that discussed the risks. Obviously each office is responsible for setting & following protocol, so I can't speak to what different offices do.
As for the doctors intentions, while I'm sure there are some doctors who are money-grubbers, I think they are few & far between the doctors who truly care about their patients and do the best they can by them.
I'm glad you are on here sharing this information so people can be made even more aware of stories like yours.
June 19, 2012
Thanks anne88...I'm ordering the frownies NOW.
Sending blessings...just remember to B-R-E-A-T-H-E...I remind myself of that a lot :)
Sending blessings...just remember to B-R-E-A-T-H-E...I remind myself of that a lot :)
June 19, 2012
thanks for the kind thoughts foreveryounglibra. you can get them the cheapest on amazon ive found.
yes i try to remember to breathe. thats really always good advice. its really getting grueling after this much time. // its just too exhausting and this isnt the only health issue i deal with. so its really not something i watned to be dealing with at this time in my life, and to keep going on soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo long.... with nooooooooooo break.. on top of the other circumstances of my life its really become torturous. i just really have completely lost my sense of humor about it at this point. // i also got very sick in other ways and had a lot of anxiety/panic as well as suicidal thoughts. thats really out of character for me but i have thought about suicide soooooo many times. so its been a really really really sucky time. i had previously imagined this year would be my best in a long time, something i really needed, and really its been among the worst of my life.
so i had the psychological stuff too really bad... i have never had this kind of anxiety and ive -never- been suicidal... but yet ive genuinely thought of suicide in the most scary kind of way almost every day for the last 6 months of so.... so i had that, and some of the physical illness.. and it really isnt prety at all. at this point i can almost breathe again.. its still probably be awhile before i ever truly relax again. but thank you i will try.
yes i try to remember to breathe. thats really always good advice. its really getting grueling after this much time. // its just too exhausting and this isnt the only health issue i deal with. so its really not something i watned to be dealing with at this time in my life, and to keep going on soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo long.... with nooooooooooo break.. on top of the other circumstances of my life its really become torturous. i just really have completely lost my sense of humor about it at this point. // i also got very sick in other ways and had a lot of anxiety/panic as well as suicidal thoughts. thats really out of character for me but i have thought about suicide soooooo many times. so its been a really really really sucky time. i had previously imagined this year would be my best in a long time, something i really needed, and really its been among the worst of my life.
so i had the psychological stuff too really bad... i have never had this kind of anxiety and ive -never- been suicidal... but yet ive genuinely thought of suicide in the most scary kind of way almost every day for the last 6 months of so.... so i had that, and some of the physical illness.. and it really isnt prety at all. at this point i can almost breathe again.. its still probably be awhile before i ever truly relax again. but thank you i will try.
June 19, 2012
I'm praying for you. Tough times don't last. Tough people do.
I've been to hell and back a few times in my life, too.
The mantra that got me through (along with holding Jesus' hand) was:
THIS, TOO, SHALL PASS. It pretty much always applies.
And, one more quote (I'm sure you already know it!) "Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem."
If you are being tormented daily, I would say you must be a major threat to the devil. He doesn't bother the people who cooperate with him.
I know you're tired, but you're still fighting and the world needs spunky chicks.
Sending love, and more encouragements should you need them, anytime!
I've been to hell and back a few times in my life, too.
The mantra that got me through (along with holding Jesus' hand) was:
THIS, TOO, SHALL PASS. It pretty much always applies.
And, one more quote (I'm sure you already know it!) "Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem."
If you are being tormented daily, I would say you must be a major threat to the devil. He doesn't bother the people who cooperate with him.
I know you're tired, but you're still fighting and the world needs spunky chicks.
Sending love, and more encouragements should you need them, anytime!
June 19, 2012
hahaaa that just really made me laugh which was awesome... // wise words!
well also luckily it isn't daily anymore. im very happy that part of things -is- much better. i still think of it like couple times a month now which is still very weird. but im definitely very very happy that stuff is getting better... i will just feel so much better when this seems to really be getting better. its just been creepy @@ anyway that was awesome thanks for the genuine laugh it gave me i appreciated that a lot. thanks & hope youre doing well.
well also luckily it isn't daily anymore. im very happy that part of things -is- much better. i still think of it like couple times a month now which is still very weird. but im definitely very very happy that stuff is getting better... i will just feel so much better when this seems to really be getting better. its just been creepy @@ anyway that was awesome thanks for the genuine laugh it gave me i appreciated that a lot. thanks & hope youre doing well.
Oh no, I'm sorry to hear about your experience. Since you were asking for ways to make it wear off faster here is a forum that might be of interest:
Botox does wear off faster if you exercise
I have also read people talk about the use of lymphatic drainage massage, green tea, and vitamins.
If you find an effective way please share it with us.